[Discussion] DW7XL PS3 exclusivity.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I'm sure most of you have read about this by now: Dynasty Warriors 7: Xtreme Legends is being released for the PS3 only in the west.

The original Dynasty Warriors 7 was ported to the Xbox 360 for its US and European release, where generally, Microsoft's console tends to sell better than the PS3 with copies of its games ranking higher on sales charts. Sales of DW7 seem to be divided between both with no console fully dominating the other*. But one must wonder why Tecmo-Koei has decided to only allow the release of the game on one console in the west as opposed to both when it's obvious that there are many, many people who bought the game for their 360s as well. Some may point to the reason being that the Xbox 360 is being gradually phased out in Japan due to extremely poor sales of the American console and nearly all current DW7 titles in Japan being exclusively for a Sony console as it was for many years (even though a lot of titles ended up being ported to PC, the original Xbox, and the 360 as well.) Some may theorize it's because the PS3 version sold better to begin with and releasing the expansion would not be profitable.

So Warriors, what's your opinion on the matter? Express your excitement, utter disappointment, whatever. But please, and I'm saying this now: DO NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT turn this discussion into a console war!

I mean it. No one wants to hear your reasons why you think one console is better than the other, okay? Save it for where it belongs, like 4chan. No flaming someone because they bought the game for one system and not the other. All I ask is you guys be mature about this. Now that that is out of the way... Personally, I'm a bit upset at their decision. I'm hoping there will be a Live Marketplace DLC release of the game in the future like there was with Samurai Warriors 2. I find it extremely unfair, to be honest. =\


*=By fully dominating the other, what I mean is, I don't see a huge difference between sales of the two. While I'm at it, let's compare them. Keep in mind that the game was only for the PS3 in Japan, so I'm not counting those sales to determine which version sold better in the west. I've read two different things from many souces, including referencing VGChartz. As for approximately how many copies sold for each version of the game:

—The Xbox 360 version sold about 87K worldwide. This version was not released in Japan.

—The PS3 version sold about 89K worldwide, not including Japan. Not a largely significant difference until the Japanese sales are factored in.

—In Japan alone, where the series is pretty popular, the exclusive PS3 version sold a whooping 457K alone.

I believe using the Japanese sales figures with the worldwide ones is a very poor way to determine how well the game sold in the west, since sales were divided between two consoles and not one. Also, I'm not saying that VGChartz and the like are fully reliable, but it's definitely something to consider.

Comments

[samanosukesgirl.livejournal.com]

As someone who loves all consoles, THIS IS MORE REASON WHY I NEED A PS 3 NOW!!

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I have both a PS3 and 360, but I ended up with the 360 version of DW7, hence my disappointment. =(

[chikyu-star.livejournal.com]

Why did you choose the 360 version over the PS3 version?

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Because I play my 360 more than my PS3 as of late. There was no other reason other than that. Games generally tend to play the same on both, aside from some slight graphical differences. It was just my preference at the time. =)

[tehseto.livejournal.com]

Being a 360 owner and not a PS3 owner, my opinion should be fairly obvious.

But as samanosukesgirl said, it's just another reason for me to want a PS3. A lot of games I want are coming to the PS3 and it's getting frustrating not being able to afford one right now. ;;

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Even with both consoles, making the switch is very costly. Not counting the fact that you'd have to repurchase the original along with the expansion, all of that DLC bought... x_x Not to mention I personally was really interested in playing story mode co-op with my mates... The game as a standalone wouldn't be anywhere near as fun without the original as a base. *sigh*

I've had a PS3 a lot longer than my 360 and back in '08 when I got, it seemed like Sony wasn't getting any where near as many games as Microsoft was. I'm amazed at the progress the system has made, especially stateside. =) I definitely use my 360 more, which is why I ended up with that version of DW7 (even though I have DW6 and its Empires counterpart for my PS3... Go figure, eh?) instead.

[tehseto.livejournal.com]

Yeah. :/ Especially since we'd have to beat everything on the original all over again. The DLC is what's going to get me too, although I've yet to get all of them so far. I've also gotten used to Koei not even bringing expansions stateside (like the SW3 ones) so I was excited to see one actually coming over here...only for it to not be for my console. fff--

Seriously! That's why I didn't get one in the beginning. It literally had nothing that I wanted. Now all the sudden a ton of stuff that I want or am interested in is PS3 exclusive.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I was going to get the special costume DLC, which costs a lot to obtain the entire set, but now I'm glad I haven't yet. Also, I've completed the game 100% on the 360 (if getting all the achievements counts as that lol.) We used to get all of the expansions back in the PS2 era. I'm grateful we're getting this one, because it seemed like the western branches had to beg them to let them localize it, but it just seems odd that they did not allow it to be ported as well. That's like... half of their sales gone and down the drain. Unless they have something planned secretly..? I think the 360 version of DW7 was revealed to be in the works a month or so after the game was originally announced for western territories. I'm still hoping against hope we'll see a release in some form. I'd rather not make the switch, but if this is a sign that DW7 Empires will also be PS3-exclusive, then... I may have to rebuy the game afterall. u_u

For real! I mean, the 360 got a bunch of exclusive RPGs (I'm a huge RPG fan, by the way) that the PS3 never saw the light of. Later on, the PS3 got some of them. Granted, they were supposed to be enhanced versions, but still... Both consoles have their strong points and I'm glad they're on equal footing now, though it seems if you're a Japanese game fan, the PS3 is the console to get. I guess it really is because they're beginning to phase the 360 out over there. Heck, even all the new "Tales of" games are going to be PS3-exclusive from now on, it seems.

[tehseto.livejournal.com]

I do remember getting a lot of the expansions back when they were on the PS2. But you do have a point about DW7 on the 360. Though I do believe it was revealed not too long after the PS3 announcement, so I have no idea. I'm just not going to get my hopes up anyway.

I'm with you on the RPG thing. And it does seem like the JRPGs are slowly becoming PS3 exclusive. I've definitely noticed that with the Tales games since I'm a Tales fan. Graces and Xillia are two games that I want. And apparently they're only bringing the PS3 Graces overseas too... Then again, I really should be used to RPG expansions being PS3 exclusive. Eternal Sonata for example. Sob.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I think we got pretty much all of them, if I remember correctly. Like I said, I'm hoping, but not expecting much to come of it. x_x

I wanted to play the expansion of Vesperia so bad (so many extra things omg *_*), but it was never localized. I think we may have Microsoft to blame for this one because of licensing rights. Same was with the enhanced version of Symphonia as well; Nintendo owned the translated script in the west, so no better PS2 version for us. I've had my eyes on those games and I'm pretty excited. I hope Xillia sees a western release, too. I played Eternal Sonata for the 360 and loved it. I think what they added to the PS3 version was costumes, extra cutscenes (to make certain parts in the game more clear, but personally, I understood it fine as it was), and two extra characters in the form of Princess Serenade and Prince Crescendo. And someone told me the way they level up is different. Like... it takes your party longer to level up, but they learn skills much quicker. Some people thought it was worth another purchase, but I was satisfied with my 360 version. =)

[ETA] Actually, I had forgotten about Sonata's extra dungeons. And there was some extra cutscenes that went along with these. Sorry. XD;

[darksilverhawk]

And since when has Koei's market research department proven themselves competent lately?

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I know, right? I firmly believe if Samurai Warriors 3 would have been for the PS3 to begin with, there'd be a higher chance we'd be seeing a release date of the enhanced version. Way to not target your core audience... But since the Wii is a big seller in Japan, it's not surprising it would still move copies regardless.

Even more off-topic, but I'm a bit annoyed we won't be seeing Sengoku Basara 3's expansion localized over here, though I'm not surprised in the least. The game was a PS3 exclusive (lost potential sales with a lack of 360 port), we got shafted out of the second installment, and Capcom though it'd be a great idea to completely change the premise of the original in order to "appeal to western audiences". Right. <_< //so not bitter.

[darksilverhawk]

Musou games (and SenBasa as well) would probably move copies in Japan if you put them on the Dreamcast BUT THAT ASIDE I'm guilty of buying a Wii for SW3 and while it was is great game I would have rather had an even better game and had to save up for a PS3. :/ The entire fiasco that was SW3 from start to finish was utterly absurd.

I've given up on anything Basara ever coming overseas again. As nice as it would be, it's just not making waves over here, Capcom is doing nothing to promote it, and anyone likely to discover it in spite of this is probably in the fandom already, so the fanbase isn't really growing. We're fairly small, we're just really vocal.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Yeah, for real. XD I never owned a Wii and never plan on getting one (though that new Zelda game is tempting me more and more *_*) and I was so bummed when it ended up being only for the Wii. Later with the enhanced version announced, I was so pumped to be able to finally play it. But lo and behold, it was canceled in the west. I'm still baffled by their decision, but sales speak louder than words and the game sold pathetically over here even for a Warriors game. x_x

Capcom are the kings of professionally trolling, I've come to realize. I mean... It's ironic I used my Devil May Cry icon in my last comment because I'm very irate at them for what they plan on doing to the series. The upside? At least the Hollywood movie that's in the works about it is based on Ninja Theory's mess and not the original, but still. I'm not sure we're ever going to see another good DMC game unless Hideki Kamiya and Platinum Games make it. (Unless Capcom pulls their head out of their asses, which is highly unlikely.)

[rydain]

What a crock. If KOEI didn't intend to fully support the 360 version with all the planned additional content, they should have made DW7 a PS3 exclusive. I feel bad for people who bought the game with the reasonable expectation of being able to enjoy the rest of the add-ons.

Though it's nice to see that XL has decloned a few characters, I'm disappointed at the apparently limited extent of such. So far, they've made new move sets that use the same base weapon, and I expect to see this trend continue. Tweaking motions is far faster than developing models, hit boxes, and all the other additional data required for new weapons. At least they're trying to mix things up, but I doubt I'm ever going to get my buckler blade back at this rate.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I didn't think they'd pull such a stunt, so I didn't think twice about getting the 360 version, as I'm sure a lot of other people thought the same at the time. What kills me is the fact that they're letting a high percentage (about 50%, give or take) of their sales go along with making a lot of people angry and disappointed. Unless something is announced and the decision is reversed in some form, I get the feeling this game will not sell very well. I hate sound like such a pessimist. Even if I would've bought the other version, I'd still be here in this discussion, trying to figure out what stupidity has infected their heads to come to such a fail decision. D=

They're trying, but fans will never be happy. They're always going to be someone complaining, but that's how it always is. I heard they've only decloned Shu characters, unless my info is out of date, that is. Koei has been treating Cao Ren badly since... DW6? I liked him in 4 and 5, but wtf is with the new character design? I really liked his old weapon, too. )=

[rydain]

Sad as it may be, I wouldn't be surprised if KOEI considers the Western fan base to be an albatross around their neck. We aren't getting SW3:XL or Empires, or DW7 Special for the PSP. The current generation character designs, a significant departure from the more traditionally Chinese costumes of the classic era, are clearly influenced by popular Japanese media tropes. Feh, at least I still have my full DW/SW/WO collection to enjoy.

Last I heard, Xiahou Dun, Guan Yu, Zhao Yun, and Zhang Fei were decloned for XL. Guo Jia and Wang Yi got brand new move sets. KOEI hasn't handled an ensemble cast properly since Warriors Orochi, which managed to give everyone something meaningful - even if brief - within an overall narrative that was surprisingly good for a corny crossover fan service extravaganza. Nowadays, all they care to do is focus on a few people and phone in everybody else.

As to Cao Ren, I'm guessing that the designers don't like his somber sensitive badass archetype from 4 and 5, and his fan base is negligible enough that they don't care about maintaining the nuances of his original character. Same goes for everyone else drastically changed in 6 and later, like Elf Princess Yue Ying. (I heard that her old school battle dress designs were unpopular in Japan.) Revamps can work - O HAI THAR LU MENG - but you'd think they could do some market research to maintain that something for everyone appeal by keeping the niche characters' fan preferred characteristics. Then again, methinks I'm asking too much from a company that has no qualms about pissing off half of their paying Western fan base.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't doubt it, either... *sigh* I love traditional Chinese clothes and I wish they would use them more, but since it's a Japanese game, anime-esque designs have definitely made their mark in terms of outfits and such. But since it's their culture, I suppose the influence is inevitable. Some characters are not too bad, but others really make me wonder sometimes. =\

I loved Warriors Orochi for that, despite it being a total fanboy's dream of a crossover (not that this is a bad thing.) It seemed like everyone was important in some way, and like you said, even if just a little. I think DW7's story mode is definitely a step in the right direction, though. But it's a shame that a lot of characters weren't featured as much as they should have been. I thought the Legendary battles in Conquest were going to somewhat make up for that, but I don't know about you, but I couldn't help but come away unimpressed after completing them. =( It seemed to be that they were rushed and shoved in at the last second. Pretty sad because there was so much that could have been done with those scenarios...

Some people were improved while others were, well... Is ruined too strong of a word? Sometimes, you have to wonder if they realize that changing a character to suit a certain archetype (like making the men more attractive or "bishounen" like, etc., as found in a lot of Japanese anime) tends to piss off that person's fans? Sometimes a revamp is great, but I can't help but feel that most characters were prettied up just to satisfy certain corners of their audience. I know it's a Japanese game and all, but come on. It's based on Chinese history for crying out loud. As a female fan, I love and hate them for what they've done to certain characters, but I suppose being too much of a stickler for historical accuracy and demanding it in a fantasy game is unrealistic.

Of course, what's not unrealistic is releasing a game for a large percentage of your fanbase. Why the stinginess? In the end, us as fans are gonna be the ones hurting, not them. I'm dreading the day this series ever tanks because some moron up at Tecmo-Koei thought it'd be a brilliant idea to play console favorites... again. Because, you know, it worked out so well last time it happened. *cough*

[donesschen.livejournal.com]

I have both the Xbox 360 and PS3, but bought DW7 for PS3 only because I wanted to play online for free. So I guess I'm safe, but I do feel sorry for those who don't have a PS3 :(.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

It sucks, especially for those who don't have a PS3, not to mention the ones who do and would have to rebuy the game, expansion... And all that freaking DLC, omg. And to think I was going to buy the expensive special costumes, too. I'm thankful I waited in case I never get to see any more DW7 titles being released on the 360. The entire situation is just extremely frustrating because of the obvious stupidity on Koei's part... >_>

[viajeras.livejournal.com]

It's total BS that XL isn't coming to 360. I'm a PS3 user, but I'm still disappointed in Koei (not like it would be the first time this year.) I'm just bracing myself, because this decision just feels like a bad sign for Koei games in the west.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Same here. I have a PS3 as well and even if I would've bought it for Sony's console, I'd still be pretty aggravated at them for such an idiotic decision. I worry sometimes that we aren't going to see any more games from them over here in the west because of their terrible marketing tactics... <_<

[creamedice.livejournal.com]

At least this is coming out in English...

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I'm totally grateful for it, don't get me wrong. But I still find it odd they would put an axe in the heart of half of their Western fanbase. D=

[creamedice.livejournal.com]

Guess I'm still bitter about SW3XL/Z not coming out in English in any form...

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Completely understandable. =\

[lightwishes.livejournal.com]

I'm a PS3 user, so I'm not incredibly upset about this but I am pretty confused. I don't understand their reasons for doing something like this. Was there some sort of behind-the-scenes business deal or something?

I feel for you who bought DW7 360 version. I'd be hella annoyed about this.

[evergreen-chaos.livejournal.com]

Usually, they have to sign a contract with Microsoft to release the game on the 360 that's PS3 only game (in origin). Maybe they didn't get the confirmation from Microsoft to bring XL over for the 360 and just stuck with the PS3 version only because too many people were demanding for it?

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

A lot of things point to it being the Japanese Tecmo-Koei branch's decision. From what I've read on the TK European Twitter, they tried to get the game for the 360 as well, but their Japanese counterpart only allowed it for PS3. Now don't quote me or anything, because this is just an assumption I've come to based on what I've read and pieced together from the hints dropped. It still doesn't change the fact that it sucks... I'm hoping their minds will change and we'll get the game, but so far, things aren't looking too hopeful in this aspect as of right now. *sigh*

[evergreen-chaos.livejournal.com]

As someone who bought the PS3 version to solely play with people who only have a PS3, it's not a big loss to me. Besides.. the PS controller feels more comfortable to me than the 360 one. (I only use the 360 for 360 exclusive RPGs that I wanna play... which is rarely ever.) And since I've been playing DW games since 4 on the PS2, it's kinda just default for me to buy DW games for the PS3. (Especially since the boyfriend hoards the 360 to play CoD:MW2 everyday, all day/night long after work.)

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

I own pretty much everything Warriors for the PS2 or PS3. It was just a bad coincidence that the one time I went with the 360 version, I'm screwed out of the expansion. But a lot of other fans, including me, you see... We didn't think much of it because it was obvious Koei was supporting the 360 in the west by porting and releasing their titles for the 360 nearly consistently this generation. No one who bought this version is at fault because of the previous releases; we all assumed we'd be getting the same games as PS3 users. What angers a lot of people is the fact that it's a terrible marketing decision on TK's part to not release it on both consoles, considering the 360 made about half the sales for the game to begin with, at least in the west. We love the series and we don't want to see the game no longer be localized because of the foolish decision they made that we as fans have to suffer for. I mean... Look what happened with Samurai Warriors 3. Granted, we are grateful it's being released, but you can see where our frustration stems from. =(

[cherrytruck.livejournal.com]

I'm a PS3 player, but if the situation was turned around and only Xbox users got the exclusive content and not the PS3 users, I'd be quite pissed for sure!

I really don't get why they'd leave out a particular audience who happen to use a different console. Like everyone said, DW7 was released on both consoles so you'd expect them to be treated equally. It's a pretty bad decision they've made on the fact that not only is it really going to displease Xbox fans, it might also damage their future sales of Xbox-only users (most of us aren't fortunate enough to own both PS3 and Xbox, I presume) and they're missing out on a big audience!

I hope Koei realize the disappointment they're doing to half their western fans and perhaps change their mind while they can.

[sakichi.livejournal.com]

Even though I'm a 360 player, I'd still be bloody irate if we got something the PS3 users didn't. If the situation were to be changed and we'd get a version of the game or some other advantages over PS3 players after the fact, I'd be pretty pissed. My reaction would essentially be, "Are you freaking serious..? Why didn't you guys port it in the first place and stop playing favorites from the get-go?!"

It's all so frustrating. Aside from being stingy, not to mention stupid, it's ridiculous that they would intentionally (or not. They don't seem very bright up there at Tecmo-Koei, especially lately...) screw over half of their Western fanbase. And what makes me upset is that we never were given a straight reason. People have theorized what I said in the original post, including issues with mixjoy/disc-swapping, but nothing official. I think it's the fact that we're getting abandoned on a street corner and snubbed all at the same time without an explanation of why they decided what they did is what has been angering people the most.

I'm still hoping and crossing my fingers that they have something they're plotting to do, which is why TK hasn't released a formal explanation of the situation. If not, they can kiss half of their sales goodbye.

[teambenevolence.livejournal.com]

I'm late for the party and I know I've already given my thoughts about this but yeah.

I remember there was a bit of a fuss because the DLC was being released while the PSN was still down, and so only 360 users could get it. THEN PSN users got charged double for the DLC for a short while before it got sorted. Some sort of payback? :p

I suppose one thought for Koei JP is that the west isn't their big market. Hell, DW7 sold better in the UK than in America from what I've heard. But even in Europe it is nowhere near as big as in the east. I mean, even with the disasters in Japan it still sold enough to hit number one in the charts, whereas in the UK it hit 10, and it barely sold a few thousand in the States.

It could simply be problems with Microsoft, concerns over disc-swapping etc or it could be Koei JP don't care. I mean, we're not getting DW7 Special for the PSP either, and afaik it's not been confirmed yet whether we'll be getting DW for the PS Vita next year either. I really hope so, as DW is one of the games that got me interesting in buying a Vita.

Although I have a PS3 and won't be affected it still sucks they would deliberately alienate their fanbase and ensure the game sells even less here. While yeah, thanks to youtube and so on footage will be online within minutes of someone getting a copy, it really isn't the same as playing it yourself.

[ryuudo.livejournal.com]

Also quite late, but I'm pretty sure that the real reason they aren't porting DW7:XL to Xbox 360 is that the technology they use in DW7 isn't compatible with it. I'm not saying that they couldn't do complete DLC the way they did with SW2:XL in Xbox, but... clearly they have no intent to do so for a game they have to port to a system that it wasn't originally released for in Japan.

Personally? As a PS3-version owner, I'm fine with it. I do own an Xbox though, and had considered purchasing that version of the game while PSN was down though, so I could just as easily be in the other camp. It is disappointing though, as everyone should get the chance to play it if they can affort to - and yet at the same time, given their current stance on SW, I think we're lucky to be getting it at all.