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Oct. 29th, 2007 08:49 am![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
geebs.livejournal.com posting in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
musou_warriorsSo over the weekend, I finally got Lu Bu's PI in WO. Alas, not in one player mode though. I just can't seem to do the required 1000 kills within 9 minutes on my own. The best I did was 1000 in 10:30, but I never got close to doing it in that amount of time afterwards, much less shave time off. In two player mode though, getting it is a cinch. Just have both players play as Lu Bu, as it'll count the combined kills, and 500 is a more reasonable goal than 1000 within 9 minutes. Luckily, I was able to play it with ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
turdburgler to get that 2nd player.
So while it is pretty easy in 2 player mode. To me it seems near impossible in 1p. What other PIs have people found difficult to get in WO? I want to say the ones I've had the most trouble with are Ina's, Mitsuhide's, and Nobunaga's. (How odd that its all SW guys).
Ina- it took me a while to figure this out, because the FAQ I read wasn't clear. It basically sounds like the same requirements to unlock Keiji, except Ina has to kill 500 (there's so many enemies in this stage, that's no problem) But I didn't realize there was another reiniforcemnt after Hanzo (Yoshimioto). Since Lu Meng doesn't tell you to hit the drum again, the only way you'd know is if you heard it from someone else or just happened to be fooling around and hit the drum after getting Hanzo and beating the reinforcement Keiji calls right after that.
Anyways, you also can't kill the last reinforcement Keiji calls, the one that appears from the northeastern most gate. But, if Hanzo and Zhou Tai aren't at the gate by the time that guy appears, they'll get stuck fighting him and they won't get to Keiji's front door in time. So you have to kill him, thus losing you the item.
Basically, between each banging of the drum/defeating of an officer that Keiji sends after the base, I kept closing gate captains/killing other officers to keep my allies from getting overwhelmed. I believe the next to last reinforcement Keiji calls appears from the boat gate all the way in the southeast. So you should get Zhou Tai and Hanzo to Keiji's fort by clearing out that entire north path before killing that guy. Then you can beat the officer, bang the drum for Yoshimoto appear, and basically guide the rest of your allies to the southern entrance of Keiji's fort. One thing to watch out for is Yoshimoto follows you, so Yoshimoto won't go to the gate unless you go to the gate. So if the rest of your allies are heading to the southern gate of the fort, and you turn back to fight enemies somewhere else, Yoshimoto will follow you instead of going to the fort. But once you get all of them to the fort before ten minutes are left in the stage, AND you don't kill the Keiji reinforcement that appears from the northeast, you should get the item.
Mitsuhide Akechi- Akechi's is kinda a pain because you have to protect Sakon from taking any damage AT ALL! But, you have to also make sure no officers enter your home base or he'll turn back and no longer try to escape. the board starts out with Guan Yu charging your base from the east. You need to kill him and close any gates nearby to clear the path for when Sakon tries to escape. Then Zhang Fei will then charge your base from the north. Close out any gates/kill nearby officers before you kill him.
Once both GY and ZF are dead, Sakon will make for the escape point. Here you have to stick on him like white on rice until he gets to the escape point and make sure no one hits him. I think some enemies come down the middle river to attack from the east, and you need to quickly kill those guys. If you cleared things out when fighting Guan Yu, no one should be accosting Sakon while you kill those. Some generals attack your home base from the north, but your allies will hold them off. The key is to save, save, save whenever you make any forward progress with Sakon. Then, once he escapes, you should get the item.
Nobunaga Oda- Another pain in the butt. Its stage 1 of the SW story. You basically have to hook up with Guan Ping and Huang Zhong and they have to have 80% life and you have to kill 500 before Cao Pi appears. The problem is stopping certain events from happening which will either cause HZ/GP to charge the enemies and get killed. Or making sure you don't kill too many officers. Cao Pi appears after you kill more than 7 officers, so you don't want to do that until you've gotten the required number of kills/allied with the two Shus.
What I did was charge straight for Cao Ren and kill him immediately. And I mean really immediately, otherwise the rest of the army will enter the castle and gang up on Huang Zhong. I killed another officer there in the middle (not the one in the bottom right fort in the middle, you need him to be alive) and charged towards Guan Ping to rescue him from the ambush. Do not close that gate near there!
This is why, you need enough time to get the requisite 500 kills. This is one way to buy time and keep Guan Ping alive. Guan Ping will waste his time on that gate captain, then the officer you kept alive, then the gate captain north of that officer (so don't kill that one either), then the officer fighting the south gate. If those guys don't stop him, he'll charge towards the main group of generals in the west.
Same goes for Huang Zhong, if you meet up with him too early, he'll charge those generals. So basically, after rescuing Guan Ping, kill all the little dots of red you see on your way to that big clump of enemies in the west. Kill to your hearts content (though not the officers!) until you're around 475. Then kill the guys you left alive to tie up Guan Ping, then immediately run and hook up with huang Zhong. You should get 500 kills by then and get the item.
So those are my opinions on the hard PIs to get, and what I needed to do to get them, in case any others are having trouble with it. But that had me thinking, throughout the various series, what 4th/5th/10th/11th weapons (since there were no PIs back then) gave you the most trouble?
I never really played SW1 but once, so I can't weigh in on it or SW:XL. But in terms of SW2 and DW3-5, including the XLs, I want to say:
Guan Yu's 10th and 11th from DW4 and DW4:XL. I don't remember what the requirements for his 11th from DW4:XL were, only it was a big hassle. But his 10th gave me problems. I mean, beating the Wu reinforcements was no problem, it was actually beating the level (Fan Castle!) afterwards on hard that took me forever to do.
Cao Ren's 10th from DW4. He's a squat little dwarf, and relatively slow. But his requirements were to destroy all the siege weapons attacking Fan Castle within a certain time, which is pretty hard with such a slow little fella.
Yue Ying's 10th from DW4. The problem was keeping Zhuge Liang alive in that insane Nanman stage on hard. The way I did it was killing 1000 guys to get the super morale boost you used to get in those games for killing 1000. That one also took me forever.
Tadakatsu Honda's 4th from SW2. You had to keep people from entering the 3 forts. But it was random where they'd start, so you'd have to save between each wave and hope it'd be a setup that was actually doable.
I got all the 10ths and 11ths from DW4/XL, all the 4ths from SW2, and most of the final weapons in DW5 (I think I tired of the game eventually and only had Huang Gai, Lu Meng, Zhang Jiao, Dong Zhou, and possibly Pang Tong left to play) and those are the only ones I can remember right now having trouble with. (I know, I have too much time on my hands!) That's close to 150 different requirements though, so I'm sure there are others I had difficulty with that I'm not remembering.
turdburgler to get that 2nd player.So while it is pretty easy in 2 player mode. To me it seems near impossible in 1p. What other PIs have people found difficult to get in WO? I want to say the ones I've had the most trouble with are Ina's, Mitsuhide's, and Nobunaga's. (How odd that its all SW guys).
Ina- it took me a while to figure this out, because the FAQ I read wasn't clear. It basically sounds like the same requirements to unlock Keiji, except Ina has to kill 500 (there's so many enemies in this stage, that's no problem) But I didn't realize there was another reiniforcemnt after Hanzo (Yoshimioto). Since Lu Meng doesn't tell you to hit the drum again, the only way you'd know is if you heard it from someone else or just happened to be fooling around and hit the drum after getting Hanzo and beating the reinforcement Keiji calls right after that.
Anyways, you also can't kill the last reinforcement Keiji calls, the one that appears from the northeastern most gate. But, if Hanzo and Zhou Tai aren't at the gate by the time that guy appears, they'll get stuck fighting him and they won't get to Keiji's front door in time. So you have to kill him, thus losing you the item.
Basically, between each banging of the drum/defeating of an officer that Keiji sends after the base, I kept closing gate captains/killing other officers to keep my allies from getting overwhelmed. I believe the next to last reinforcement Keiji calls appears from the boat gate all the way in the southeast. So you should get Zhou Tai and Hanzo to Keiji's fort by clearing out that entire north path before killing that guy. Then you can beat the officer, bang the drum for Yoshimoto appear, and basically guide the rest of your allies to the southern entrance of Keiji's fort. One thing to watch out for is Yoshimoto follows you, so Yoshimoto won't go to the gate unless you go to the gate. So if the rest of your allies are heading to the southern gate of the fort, and you turn back to fight enemies somewhere else, Yoshimoto will follow you instead of going to the fort. But once you get all of them to the fort before ten minutes are left in the stage, AND you don't kill the Keiji reinforcement that appears from the northeast, you should get the item.
Mitsuhide Akechi- Akechi's is kinda a pain because you have to protect Sakon from taking any damage AT ALL! But, you have to also make sure no officers enter your home base or he'll turn back and no longer try to escape. the board starts out with Guan Yu charging your base from the east. You need to kill him and close any gates nearby to clear the path for when Sakon tries to escape. Then Zhang Fei will then charge your base from the north. Close out any gates/kill nearby officers before you kill him.
Once both GY and ZF are dead, Sakon will make for the escape point. Here you have to stick on him like white on rice until he gets to the escape point and make sure no one hits him. I think some enemies come down the middle river to attack from the east, and you need to quickly kill those guys. If you cleared things out when fighting Guan Yu, no one should be accosting Sakon while you kill those. Some generals attack your home base from the north, but your allies will hold them off. The key is to save, save, save whenever you make any forward progress with Sakon. Then, once he escapes, you should get the item.
Nobunaga Oda- Another pain in the butt. Its stage 1 of the SW story. You basically have to hook up with Guan Ping and Huang Zhong and they have to have 80% life and you have to kill 500 before Cao Pi appears. The problem is stopping certain events from happening which will either cause HZ/GP to charge the enemies and get killed. Or making sure you don't kill too many officers. Cao Pi appears after you kill more than 7 officers, so you don't want to do that until you've gotten the required number of kills/allied with the two Shus.
What I did was charge straight for Cao Ren and kill him immediately. And I mean really immediately, otherwise the rest of the army will enter the castle and gang up on Huang Zhong. I killed another officer there in the middle (not the one in the bottom right fort in the middle, you need him to be alive) and charged towards Guan Ping to rescue him from the ambush. Do not close that gate near there!
This is why, you need enough time to get the requisite 500 kills. This is one way to buy time and keep Guan Ping alive. Guan Ping will waste his time on that gate captain, then the officer you kept alive, then the gate captain north of that officer (so don't kill that one either), then the officer fighting the south gate. If those guys don't stop him, he'll charge towards the main group of generals in the west.
Same goes for Huang Zhong, if you meet up with him too early, he'll charge those generals. So basically, after rescuing Guan Ping, kill all the little dots of red you see on your way to that big clump of enemies in the west. Kill to your hearts content (though not the officers!) until you're around 475. Then kill the guys you left alive to tie up Guan Ping, then immediately run and hook up with huang Zhong. You should get 500 kills by then and get the item.
So those are my opinions on the hard PIs to get, and what I needed to do to get them, in case any others are having trouble with it. But that had me thinking, throughout the various series, what 4th/5th/10th/11th weapons (since there were no PIs back then) gave you the most trouble?
I never really played SW1 but once, so I can't weigh in on it or SW:XL. But in terms of SW2 and DW3-5, including the XLs, I want to say:
Guan Yu's 10th and 11th from DW4 and DW4:XL. I don't remember what the requirements for his 11th from DW4:XL were, only it was a big hassle. But his 10th gave me problems. I mean, beating the Wu reinforcements was no problem, it was actually beating the level (Fan Castle!) afterwards on hard that took me forever to do.
Cao Ren's 10th from DW4. He's a squat little dwarf, and relatively slow. But his requirements were to destroy all the siege weapons attacking Fan Castle within a certain time, which is pretty hard with such a slow little fella.
Yue Ying's 10th from DW4. The problem was keeping Zhuge Liang alive in that insane Nanman stage on hard. The way I did it was killing 1000 guys to get the super morale boost you used to get in those games for killing 1000. That one also took me forever.
Tadakatsu Honda's 4th from SW2. You had to keep people from entering the 3 forts. But it was random where they'd start, so you'd have to save between each wave and hope it'd be a setup that was actually doable.
I got all the 10ths and 11ths from DW4/XL, all the 4ths from SW2, and most of the final weapons in DW5 (I think I tired of the game eventually and only had Huang Gai, Lu Meng, Zhang Jiao, Dong Zhou, and possibly Pang Tong left to play) and those are the only ones I can remember right now having trouble with. (I know, I have too much time on my hands!) That's close to 150 different requirements though, so I'm sure there are others I had difficulty with that I'm not remembering.
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Date: 2007-10-29 07:04 pm (UTC)Wow, I actually remember that one. Playing that stage was HARD. Even using 2-player to help keep you alive. I remember even with Chris on 2-player it still took me about 7 or 8 tries to get it (and I think I finally managed to get it in 1-player mode, in the end). And you had to worry about kill-steals all over the place, because you had to kill some guys who turn traitor on you in the middle of the stage, and Lu Bu (or someone else really hard to beat) charges out at some point and kicks your arse all over the place. Did they have interim saves back then? I can't remember...
Tadakatsu Honda's 4th from SW2.
Very, very hard with 1 player, easy with 2. I guess for some of these there two ideas of what is considered "hard". One type of "hard" is "this is hard with one player (but easy with two)", and the other is "this is impossible to do with either 1 player or 2".
I also don't consider it cheating to use 2 players to get some of this stuff. I mean, why is it cheating if they intentionally let you do it? No man is an island. (doesn't Sakon say that at some point?) :P So why not utilize it?
Now using cheat codes is definitely cheating, and abusing some software glitch also cheating. :P I'm not sure if I consider the reload "feature" in SW2 cheating or not -- this is where you go to upgrade a weapon, and if you don't like what bonus you get you reload your savegame and then try again. And you keep doing this on one slot until you get something you like, and then you finally save it and move on to the next weapon slot -- wash, rinse, repeat. I wasted a lot of time reloading over and over in SW2 to do this for a couple of characters. Blech! I like the WO system better.
I never really played SW1 but once, so I can't weigh in on it
SW1 was so HARD... I think I gave up on the game before getting to the point of getting peoples' 4ths. Either that or I only got the 4ths for a select subset of people. Maybe Sanada, Kunoichi, Oda and Hanzo. I can't really remember what any of them involved though. Hanzo's was probably one of those god-awful castle stages that I hateHateHated! I remember quitting the game just after I unlocked Goemon Ishikawa and played him through a couple of levels (ugh, the endless awful castle stages...). I quickly decided his moveset was so terrible that I would never ever play him again (he's actually not bad in WO though).
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Date: 2007-11-05 08:32 pm (UTC)Nobunaga's seems to have multiple strategies, all about equally successful. Beyond killing Cao Ren at the start, hooking up with Guan Ping, then hooking up with Huang Zhong, and then running over to Mitsunari to kill all of his peons, it seems your real goal here is to just not kill any more officers than you absolutely have to until you've accomplished your 500 peon goal. You can easily kill 500 peons in Mitsunari's area alone, so it doesn't really matter if you kill peons elsewhere before you get there.
I killed both of those gate captains that you mentioned and Guan Ping still screwed around with the random peons running around in that area and pretty much just stayed out of trouble the whole time. I ran up to Huang Zhong to ally with him immediately after Guan Ping and he just followed me into Mitsunari's area. Because I was there with him, the officers in that area were wagging on me instead of him, and he managed to get himself tied up with peons the whole time I was slaughtering Mitsunari's forces to up my KO count.
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Date: 2007-11-11 05:21 am (UTC)Ina None of your own reinforcements can be in your party. This includes Zhou Tai (whoops, I had him equipped the first time and failed even though all requirements were met), Hanzo Hattori, Ieyasu Tokugawa, and presumably Imagawa Yoshimoto. The rest of your reinforcements are generic officers. Not sure if Lu Meng can be in your party, but I'd say no just to be safe.
Also, I think you only have to summon and meet up with Imagawa Yoshimoto. I got the item message and Yoshimoto was nowhere near Keiji's camp (he was stuck fighting that damn officer you're not allowed to kill in the upper right and I was attempting to lure that officer toward Keiji's camp to get Yoshimoto *to* Keiji's camp when I surprisingly got the item message).